Topic: Elite Haitian Women Prefer White Men (
Post your comment)
Here are the latest comments from our readers about Elite Haitian Women Prefer White Men
Read them all and submit your own comments
by Adeline on 6/2
Sandra,
I am not sure that you are being fair to white women with that statement " they don't date for security and love, but for sex".
This is a general statement about a whole race of women.
Are you saying that they are not able to love?.
that the only thing they want in a relationship is sex?
LOL
Every one is different, we were born with different personality, temperament.
We need to be careful about general statement like that. It sounds negative.
Again, I will repeat my previous statement, maybe our haitian men are treating us that way, because we accept it. As a matter of fact, I know that some women, sometimes, encourage such stupid behaviors at the beginning of the relationship (because we want to please them so much ), then we complain later.
These men don't change.
What you see/get at the beginning of the relationship is what you will get throughout the relationship
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to Adeline on 17-Jun-08 08:34 PM
Adeline my name is Lavie, were you referring to me or Sandra?
Yes my statement was a general one, but there is a signicant paradign regarding Haitian elite women preferring white men for reasons other than sex as opposed to Haitian men who prefer white women for sex among other things.
I did quote "Elite" not your average Haitian women.
peace
Lavie
(Reply)
by adeline, replying to lavie on 20-Jun-08 10:47 PM
Hi Lavie,
I was not responding to you. My comment was regarding Message # 31 that was posted by Sandra Pierre on 06/02. I do not think that her comment "One thing that haitian men do not know is that white women do not date for security or love but for sex." is fair to white women in general.
Yes, there may be a cultural difference between us Haitian women and white women of different nationality.
Let's not forget that an american white woman May think or behave in a different manner than an European white woman.
It is more a cultural thing than a race thing.
Out of curiosity I'd like to know what you think the reason is that Haitian elite women prefer white men?
And why do you think the reason is different for a "non-elite" Haitian woman?
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to adeline on 01-Jul-08 11:15 AM
Hi Adeline,
I totally agree with you in regards to the vast cultural differences between European and American woman.
In fact a chinese American is different culturally than an European one. I don't believe white women seek Haitian men or any man for that matter exclusively for sex. Adeline, I wrote this statement over a year ago and I'm still getting feed back from it....
amazing.
When I refered to the word "Elite" I didn't mean it in a negative conotation.
I equate Elite in terms of being intelligent, educated, and well adjusted Haitian women no matter what socio economic status they descended from. In today's modern era love has no color limit, women of today have taken off their blindfolds and are exploring the treasure chest of any man who has it to offer.
Peace
Lavie
(Reply)
by Sandra Pierre on 6/2
Well, to tell the truth I did not try a white men yet, but if one cross my path I will certainly try it. Why?
simply because haitian men always treat haitian women like their maids, they want us to do everything for them. They expect us to go to work, to cook, to take care of the house and the kids;however, I do not mind doing it as soon as I get respect, love, and appreciation, because we were brought up in a society where it was always been the women's job to take care of the family.
Meanwhile, when haitian men date white women they are the one who play the maid's role, they even wash their underwears while these women will not even get them a glass of water.
One thing that haitian men do not know is that white women do not date for security or love but for sex. Guys, I know that there are some bad haitian women just in any other nationalities; just learn how to pick a good haitian women, appreciate their values, love them and you will have the best women in the world.
Trust me, we do not want the white men, you guys pushed us to them.
(Reply)
by jan Palmqvist, replying to Sandra Pierre on 27-Jan-10 05:41 PM
DEAR MISS SANDRA
IM JAN FROM SWEDEN., HAVE A SMALL COMPANY, GEOLOGIST, GEMS
IT WOULD BE A GREAT HONOR TO CHAT O TALK WITH YOU .
I WISH ALL THE BEST TO YOUR COUNTRY AND ALL YOUR PEOPLE THERE .
ALL THE BEST
JAN
(Reply)
by max, replying to Sandra Pierre on 18-Oct-09 06:18 PM
I LOVE YOUR COMMENT.
I think it is well said and i seen my mother go through the same situation you have stated.
WELL DONE!
(Reply)
by gh P, replying to Sandra Pierre on 14-Oct-09 05:31 PM
Whoever wrote this have alack of knowledge on the topic ahe is writtin about.
Women everywhere in the world are being abused, and for your information, it;s happening in here in America.
Black, write, Spanish, women of every color are experinced abuse by write black, spanish, and write men. Take some Sociology classes, visit a jail and you will find out thatmost mem behin bars for abuse are not haitian, not even black, they are write.
what you need to do is to help women, in genaral, make better choice if you are amart enough to do so. But posting stereotyping opinion on the web.
(Reply)
by terrence Crawford, replying to Sandra Pierre on 31-Aug-09 03:19 PM
I am a african american male and I appreciate my beautiful black sisters.
A white man will only be nice for so long then he demeans and belittle u. Whether haitian, jamaican, african american we are all the same. A white woman can only show me where a black woman is!
(Reply)
by Marie on 5/17
its a shame!
it is a known fact that people can not see past a person skin especially if they are looking through the naked eye. only if they use their heart will they see a person for who they are. Me personally i have no attraction what so ever towards the white race. i love my black berries.
i will always show them"the same respect" they show me!
if you get my drift?
God created man in his own image but man does not look at each other through Gods eyes. It really is a shame
(Reply)
by j.c, replying to Marie on 15-Nov-10 03:51 PM
I am American and I am black I think that you love whom you love and that is good enough why should you have choose some one for your self to please some one if they white then so be it if they black then so be it b rown, yellow are what ever color remember this that all of us breath the some air eat the food that the earth grows and see the same SUN so we are the same as far as being human go now as for me I want a haitian sister not because they are of a different country it is because I am attracted to them so enough with this color thing peace
(Reply)
by yolande, replying to Marie on 28-May-08 02:09 PM
"Its a shame!
it is a known fact that people can not see past a person skin"
The Bible teaches us that "Man looks on the outward appearance and that only God looks at the hearts of man" The initial reaction to man is the outside of a person, RIGHT?
RIGHT!
We can not truly see a person until we get to know them. You say that you have "NO ATTRACTION WHAT SO EVER TOWARDS THE WHITE RACE." So, what are you looking at?
Their Skin - God created all skin types, Red Yellow Black and White
I believe to each it's own. I wouldn't classify all Elite Haitian Women, but you like what feels good to you and what makes you happy..
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to Marie on 18-May-08 11:46 AM
Hi Marie, how are you?
Your message this time sounds unlike your personality in your previous message.
This time you sound spiritual and very much naturally earth bound.
It is possible to see man through God's eyes, in fact this is how God wants us to see each other in terms of being brothers and sisters.
I also believe that if you are attracted to another race or ethnicity it's of vital importance to be knowledgeable about one's culture and historical background, and what makes one the individual they are. Marie I believe in my heart that we are on the same page lol.
Peace
Lavie
(Reply)
by Marie F. on 5/4
It truely does not matter what color a person is; however ethnicity is the challenge when relating to marriage, relationships and family.
I am of Haitian ethnicity and I find it challenging to relate on a cultural basis to Americans, whether black or white.
Therefore I often come across as offensive; and I am very aware of that charateristic which is why I rarely get into the conversations with Americans, There are a few factors that can relate to this experience and they are all related to having direct cultural affiliations with ones Caribbean roots.
I do not know one West Indian or West Indian American who has not had conflicts with Americans.
These conflicts are always related to ethnic and cultural misunderstandings.
So, as Caribbean people we need to let go of the race issue because it is not an underlining factor as it is in the United States.
In the United States race appears to be an underlining factor for countless reasons; edication, employment, relationships, social gatherings etc. However from my Haitian experience class has played a big part in Haiti; however it has not played a deciding factor in whether a person accomplishes their goals, it does not break their spirit down and causes them to loose their sense of self like in the United States.
Instead in Haiti I have noticed that education is used as a tool to creat bigger opportunities.
Do not misunderstand my prospective; I a am very aware of the underliying ethnocentricities that we hold as Caribbean people that have bruised our relationships with our African American counter parts.
However I do not beleive thatmarrying outside ones race is a huge issue in Hait;it's class, and education that are the deciding factors.
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to Marie F. on 05-May-08 12:39 AM
Hi Marie, thank you for that poignant analogy of Haitian culturual aspects.
I am an West Indian American married to an Haitian and I am well aware of the "Class" paradign.
Wow!
I posted this topic a couple of years ago and I'm still getting feedback from it. Well, we all know that time and things change.
I realize that in Haiti the race issue is not seen as a problem.
Unfortunately, it can be a problem in the United states.
America's historical pass is severely strident compared to Haiti when it comes to people of color.
The majority of White Americans clump all West Indians in one melting pot and so do some African Amnericans.
White Americans don't see you as an Haitian woman any different than they do a Jamaican, trinidadian or kittian woman.
You are a black woman with a black culture, we're all the same to White Americans, and you will suffer the indignities that we as Blacks do here in America.
My husband realized that his respect toward Whites was not reciprocated when he came to America.
So when in America you have to show more respect for your African American brothers and sisters, because in the long run they will have your back. I find that Haitians can only uphold that class status among themselves when here in America, but basically that too is eliminated when in America.
People will not accept those labels here in America - those identities of not having the right name or being the right color dissapates in America.
Unfortunately, you've adapted the white colonialistic idealogies of the white slave masters of the 1700's which turned out to be a detriment to the Haitian's in the long run. It worked in the early days circa 1940's - 1950's late until a selfish family known as the Duvalier's came into power and took all of Haiti's resourses for themselves.
Now there is nothing left of Haiti and the populace is fleeing to America for a fresh start - free of "classism" and all the negative labels, now only to face another series of set backs.
Only the strong shall survive, everyone on their own. Many whites might seem to be your friend, but when they talk amongst themselves they will refer to you as the black lady (not Marie).
They are basically born with the genes that make them think they are better than Black people, they can not help themselves.
Associate with caution at all times.
Peace
Lavie
(Reply)
by marie F., replying to lavie on 05-May-08 11:47 PM
It seem to me thay you have misunderstood my political point of view as a personal perspective.
I was giving a historical and political perspective, based on my experience in the United States.
I will not get into justifying your statements of whether I have adapted to the white colonial mentality; however I wiill explain the prespective.
The Caribbean is a melting pot and as is the Unites States of America; for that reason being conscious of ones social status and political perspective does not make me or anyone a slave to white racist philosophy.
However I do agree that it presents a conscious view point of ones ethnic and cultural exsistance.
As it relates to the preference of 'elite Haitian women' dating white man I explained that race in Haiti is not a pressing issue of social opression; it is a pressing issue of mental opression, and I suppose either one disables the evolution of a free mind. So, the legacy of slavery has allowed Aficans in the Americas to explore their roots, deny their roots and embrace their roots; and that charateristic is excellent for anyone attepting to become free in the world of white racism.
Ignorance is present when any women explains that she dates outside her race for social mobility.
That in my opinion is post white colonial racism in full motion.
Now do I care that white racisit philosohpy ignores my ethnicity, yes I do; because I belive that ones ethnicity should be honored no matter where ones presents him or herself.
Now, am I conscious that white racist philosophy degrades my race and ethnicity in indirect ways; Caribbean vacation print ads, Haitian Voudoo streotypes, and the boat people genre.
Oh yes how can anyone from the Caribbean not be be offended when someone explains ' You are not West Indian your from Haiti'.
But people say these things and beleive their factual.
So, how can I not be conscious of my black womenhood, it's a political statement without being overtly political.
Just the idea of an educated black women entering a room makes EVERYONE nervous; and that is race and ethnic consciousness evovles a free mind and we as black people should not belittle the power of a free conscious mind.
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to marie F. on 11-May-08 09:59 PM
Hello Marie,
Sorry it took so long for me to get back with you, most of what you are saying I am in total agreement with. However, I have a problem with you being under the asumption that all black americans have the same experiences in life. It's unfortunate for you because you miss out on the chance to meet highly intelligent individuals like yourself of which there are many. So wipe the attitude and the defense mode away. Our West Indian black and American black descendants has had different experiences.
The American's have suffered fiercely and was subjected to severe cruelty compared to the West Indians.
Unfortunately, the psychological affects of these indignities has transcended generations.
Black Americans were promised their 40 acres and a mule and are still waiting for them. Black American's especially the older ones understandably have an edge. I understand that and so should you, I'm not saying you don't I'm just making sure you do.
The average Caucasian person can tell you his great, great, great grandmothers last name and where she's from - can you - NO, that knowledge was taken from us. Although I understand there is a DNA test from a mouth swipe that can now determine where your ancestor hails from - amazing.
Remember this - the woman (your ancestor) that was captured from that African village along with her child and put on the slave ship had her child taken away from her when she arrived in Haiti and that child was taken from her and shipped to Jamaica, Trinidad, Antigua or Even America.
You have a blood relative somewhere else in the world that you know nothing about, learn to love your descendants where ever they may be.
As far as the Class distinction in Haiti is concerned, I know for a fact that the Haitian Bourgeois majority are light skin black's who consider themselves of a high class esteem due to the whiteness of their skin. I know I've seen them at their social functions.
There is not much room there for the dark skin individual unless you have much money or many credentials.
Therefore race is an issue and always will be everywhere in the world
(Reply)
by marie F, replying to lavie on 18-May-08 04:20 PM
I traveled to Africa as a student in 1998, and 1997. As an over seas student I learned alot then any book can assure; however the one experience that I will sher is that I instantly felt a connection and that was a connection I knew was there.
Many of the experiences were very natural to me aand I felt very relaxed with the Senegalese.
In fact ther mere fact that I was Haitian allowed me to connect to my ancestors and my long lost cultural connection.
Africa is a beautiful continent.
The people are beautiful and their cultur is, like any other culture has interesting dynamics that correlate to my own. In fact there were four other students from the the Caribbean who felt the same as did I. The architecture( post colonial) wer identical of many French caribbean island.
However the connections I related to were recognizably colonial, and African.
Such as the food, the music and social relationship between parent child and grandparents and extended family members.
The post colonial identifications consisted of the mixture of French and African languages that make up Kreyol.
I will dis associate myself from my African heritage.
It would be insulting, disrespectful and rude. And for the record I can name Great, Great Great Grand parents who lived in Haiti byway of Cuba and the Dominican Republic.
I never implied that African Americans have the same experience in life. However they have a shared history that they cannot deny no matter how marginilized their communities maybe.
For example I once lived in a marginilized Black community where a significant amount of the black people were economically inndependent and working.
While a significant number of the people in the community were living on one salary incomes.
I know this because I grew up there and I love visiting my old neighborhood in East Flatbush, Brooklyn; and I would nver ever deny where I spent a significant amount of my Caribbean American experience, in East Flatbush with my very, very Haitian mother and extended Haitian neighbors.
So not all African American in the United States share the same experience, but I do stand by my assessment that Americans in the United States have shared history;whether black or white.
Take care and keep the intellectual stimulation on HIGH !
Happy Haitian Flag Day
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to marie F on 18-May-08 09:34 PM
Hi Marie, my sister use to date a guy from Senegal who was a prince.
I met most of his family and they were so bougie, more so than I was lol. It is obvious the french culture that permeates them. Marie that is a beautiful thing that you can identify your great great's, but I meant knowing from whence the African blood began.
I am both African American and West Indian (Kittician) and Bajan.
I identify heavily with both cultures and I feel that descension with you talk about African Americans.
I rightfully expect it because in your first message to me you expressed it. That's okay - it is what it is, can't change your attitude now. Do you still live in the states?
I have been married to an Haitian for over 20 years and have 3 children.
It's been nice communicating with you, I enjoy the stimulation.
Peace
Lavie
(Reply)
by adeline, replying to lavie on 16-May-08 08:13 PM
Hy guys,
What a wonderful topic.
I have enjoyed reading everyone's opinion.
I can see that these are intelligent women + men that are sharing ideas.
I am proud that we are Haitians.
I agree with many comments, disagree with some, that were made, and I would like to share mine with you.
I Don't believe you can help who you fall in love with (white, black or any other race).
If, HOWEVER the desire of your heart is ONLY FOR a white man. then you must ask yourself WHY?
WHAT IS IT ABOUT YOU ( YOURSELF) THAT YOU DON'T LOVE. It is very important to answer that question FOR YOURSELF and deal with that issue, so You don't pass that negativity to the next generation.
If you do not appreciate your african features, if your parents or society made you feel inferior because you have dark skin, nappy hair, naturally you are not going to love those same features in a partner.
I do know that certain blacks, especially in our haitian culture prefer to have relationship with whites or light skin black man, because they believe that their status in society will be elevated by that fact alone.
They want to be part of that "Bourgoie" class.
They have a low concept of themselves, low self esteem.
You guys must realize that even though we have have been physically free for many years we are still enslaved mentally.
That has kept us from moving forward since our independence!
As beautiful Haitian women we need to be very careful what we say to our little girls about their features.
We must love the dark one, the lighter one equally.
We must not refer to our hair as "good hair" or "bad hair ", just simply "different texture of hair ".
We must love ourselves first, before we look to others for love.
We need to teach our little girls that they are more than their skin color.
That they do not need a man at their side to define who they are, but even more important than that, the character of their partners is more important that the color of their partners' skin.
Having said that, let's raise our Haitian boys to be more affectionate, romantic and respecful towards women.
I believe that we deserve to be treated better than the way some of our haitian men are treating us. (that is another topic) LOL
Love you all, Just because you are HAITIANS
(Reply)
by danie, replying to adeline on 11-Jun-08 11:02 AM
Well written!I recently had the very same conversation with my husband regarding self hatred.
This is extremely common among blacks.
Being married to someone of different race does not elevate your social status.
In hollywood, the black men that are marrying the white women i.e Dennis Rodman, OJ, Charles barkley, etc...
are still not respected in society..
We must educate ourselves and get rid of this unwritten bias that we have among us. I'm currently raising two extremely smart and absolutely stunning girls.
We don't talk much about color in my house.
They describe someone as pretty or ugly by the content of his/her character..
(Reply)
by donald, replying to adeline on 01-Jun-08 01:06 PM
Adeline well said...
Haiti will only move forward when we collectively reject our archaic COLONIAL ways. Regardless of our ancestral background we Haitians can make Haiti a prosperous Island and not the International communities.
The most disheartening thing for me is that we lost our sense of purpose as Haitian.
Did our forefathers fought for us to be in this deplorable state I think not. In terms of relationships Moms & Dads keep on being positive roll models for your kids...
Well that's my 2 cents.
(Reply)
by adeline, replying to donald on 02-Jun-08 09:48 PM
Thanks Donald
I agree that if we, Haitians work together, we can make Haiti a prosperous Island again ( Don't forget Haiti used to be called the "Pearl of the islands)
The key is "WORK TOGETHER", regardless of our "ancestral background
Our forefathers would be hearbreaking, if they see Haiti right now. The slaves fought very hard to gain their freedom from the masters, because they had a vision/goal of what it would be like to live free.
Somehow we lost our vision for Haiti.
When we see a haitian in distress/pain, somehow, we've lost the ability to identify with that haitian.
We think, "it is his problem, not mine".
As a result, we are all paying for it now.
Where do we begin?
How do we move forward?
I say, One person at a time. Let's give respect to every haitian, regardless of their skin color, their education level, their class status.
Let's treat every haitian like a human being.
We need to realize that EVERYONE is important and has a place in society.
that poor woman that is taking care of your home and your children should be addressed by her name not by "woman".
The garbage man should be thanked for a job well done, not be ridiculed for being a garbage man.
Someone who is able to speak french should not be assumed more intelligent than the one that speaks only creole.
The lighter skinned with european features should not be regarded more beautiful, than the darker skinned with african features
Our biggest problem is our mind set. We are brainwashed.
As I mentinoned before, Eventhough we are no longer physically chained, we are still mentally enslaved.
(Reply)
by yolande, replying to adeline on 28-May-08 02:17 PM
Hi Adeline
Having said that, let's raise our Haitian boys to be more affectionate, romantic and respecful towards women.
I couln't agree with you more!!!
(Reply)
by adeline, replying to yolande on 29-May-08 06:15 PM
Hi Yolande,
Thanks.
We do have more serious problems than the color of their skin, Right?
LOL.
I will venture to say that some of us sometimes prefer another race, because the truth is, our own kind SOMETIMES does no treat us the way we should be treated.
They often take us for granted, they are disrespectful at times by their behavior, they don't know the meaning of compromise, but God forbid, they find a foreigner mate, (especially if she is white), they often treat her like she is gold.
All of a sudden they know how to cook and clean, they know what it is like to take their mate out on a date, They remember bithdays, and valentine day.
They remember how to hold hands, how to be affectionate.
They remember that their mate is not their punching bag.
I do not want to put all the blame on them, because, WE, HAITIAN WOMEN, WE ACCEPT A LOT OF "CRAP" FROM OUR MEN. WE OFTEN DO THAT "RESIGNE" NONSENSE, WE OFTEN HEAR FROM OUR OLDER HAITIAN FAMILY MEMBERS.
I believe that some of us do not think, that we deserve and can do better.
WHAT WE FAIL TO UNDERSTAND IS THAT AS LONG AS WE KEEP THAT SORRY EXCUSE OF A MAN AROUND, THEY WILL NOT BE ROOM FOR SOMEONE BETTER TO COME ALONG.
Many will disagree with me, I know, but the truth does hurt, and if we do not admit that there is a problem, we will never find the solution.
when we are being treated less than the loving, caring and loyal women that we are, we need to put our feet down and say "HELL NO",TREAT ME LIKE I DESERVE OR HIT THE DOOR".
LET'S START WITH OUR BABY BOYS AND GIRLS.
Keep in touch
(Reply)
by maurice Bishop, replying to adeline on 22-May-10 01:02 PM
Please to don't incite women to turn violent agains their men, for it would be mistake because most men are stronger than their spouses our girlfriend; if that happen, she would probably end up like kunta kante.
He may or may not chop that foot.
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to adeline on 18-May-08 11:52 AM
Amen Adeline, very well stated.
We need more mothers out there like you.
Peace
Lavie
(Reply)
by Jeanny on 4/11
wow, marrying white is a new deases, i think you chose the wrong type of word to express yourself.
i'm half white and half black, both my parents were born in haiti and they were in love with each other.
my father married my mother because of love not because of color (mother White).
(father black) he was in love with her and she was in love with him. they never thought that their love was a deases because it brought a new generation.
both my parents taught us to love ourselve and not to let people justify us. some of us came out black, some of us blue, some of us pink, some of brown, some of us purple and some of us white and we define it as love not a deases.
marrying someone that's your desire and no other person's business of their color not a deases but a new beginning to a new generation.
there are other ways to express your thoughts but saying that it's a deases is really offensive.
(Reply)
by shadow, replying to Jeanny on 23-Jun-08 08:53 AM
Dear Jenny, I am Shadow and I wrote the statement that you objected to. "The status of who was upper class back then was not associated just with how much money you had; your family name in the archives of Haitian history was actually more important.Skin color or money were secondary assets.
So you see, marrying white is a new disease." I pasted my whole statement below so that you could reread the whole thing in context.
I will respond to your objection and explain why my statement stands and is accurate in another post so that this one is not too long.
"It's funny to hear Lavie and Dan Xavier talk about the fact that Haitian man and women prefer to marry whites.
What neither of you realize is how this is really a recent generational change.
Previously in Haiti, let's say my mother's generation, marriage to a white of any nationality met that you had taken a step down in the social ladder.
So the real members of the elite class would never dream of doing such a thing.
"White" to us was not the same as light skin, it actually met "foreigner." The only Haitians who married whites were Haitians from the lower social stratas.
The same was true of marriage to someone who was from the middle east.
People from there were also part of the lower social strata.
We called all of them (regardless of which part of the middle east they were from) "Syrien boite lan do." Regardless of how much money they had, they were not acceptable marriage partners for most upper class Haitian families.
That was when, in Haiti, upper class actually met something.
The status of who was upper class back then was not associated just with how much money you had; your family name in the archives of Haitian history was actually more important.
Skin color or money were secondary assets.
So you see, marrying white is a new disease."
Quote from Shadow
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to Jeanny on 11-Apr-08 06:12 PM
Hi Jeanny,
I did not say that marrying white is a disease, where did you get that from?
I don't think there is anything wrong in marrying a person outside of your race or ethnicity.
I simply said in my topic that Elite Haitian women prefer white men oppose to black men. Elite women no matter what color prefer intellectual and educated men and sometimes they are more prevalent in white society.
I am sorry you misunderstood my statement.
My father is half black and my mother who is black and Cherokee Indian married him because she loved him. Again I say this is not exclusively a Haitian Women's preference.
How is that your mother was born in Haiti of white parents, please explain.
Sincerely,
Lavie
(Reply)
by jeanny, replying to lavie on 17-Apr-08 03:23 PM
Hi
Thank you for your explanation, well my grandfather still lives in Haiti so does my mother, father and many of my aunts and uncles.
We're from Jeremie, my grandfather and grandmother are from Germany, they were recently married when they arrived to Haiti.
They settled in Haiti because my father could not stay in Germany anymore due to some family issues.
Well, my mother was born in Haiti and they moved to Jeremie and so were my uncles and aunts.
She was born Haitian to my opinion, they stayed there for a while but during the Duvalie regime my grandfather had to move out of the Ville of Jeremie to the country side because he was afraid that they were going to get killed by the regime.
Till today my grandfather AKA (TiChat) still lives in Anba nan dlo Jeremie at the age of 98. My mother had the privilege to go to school because of my Grandmother (she traveled back and fourth to the states and Germany) who passed away years ago. My mother studied and came Here where she studied at Colombia and met my father in a Tabou Combo Concert in 1978 and two years later married him. although a white woman she considers herself simply Haitian, when the question is given to her she never thinks twice but simply replies, "I'm Haitian" I'm the third child of my parents born in 1983 and I can honestly say I’m so proud to have my culture it hurts.
My mother does not stay here in the states often; right now she's in Haiti during this current issue we're experiencing.
We don't stay in P-A-P; we stay in Jeremy where we consider our home to be. Nothing is really happening in Jeremy, no fighting.
Hope I answered your question.
As to your comment may be I misunderstood.
Thanks,
Jeanny
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to jeanny on 17-Apr-08 11:36 PM
Hi Jeanny,
your background is so interesting very similar to my own. Travelling in and out of the Caribbean was more acessable many years ago. People didn't need passports and various credentials to go from Island to Island and country to country.
I have a friend named Serge Gribkof who is from Haiti and from German ancestry, look at the name. I heard that there are many people of German descent in Haiti, there is a reason for it that I'm not aware of. Your mother rightfully so is Haitian, that is the culture she was brought up in, she doesn't really know the German culture.
Your mom's home base is Haiti that's where her thoughts come from, she meditates to Haitian music, and eats Haitian food. Your background is unique please forgive my ignorance in not using my thought processes to explore it. Jeanny I am still getting responses from this topic that I posted over a year ago and have made many friends.
I am on myspace, you can see my profile by going to - www.myspace.com/Lavie2 - please be my friend.
Peace
Lavie
(Reply)
by Shadow on 10/19
It's funny to hear Lavie and Dan Xavier talk about the fact that Haitian man and women prefer to marry whites.
What neither of you realize is how this is really a recent generational change.
Previously in Haiti, let's say my mother's generation, marriage to a white of any nationality met that you had taken a step down in the social ladder.
So the real members of the elite class would never dream of doing such a thing.
"White" to us was not the same as light skin, it actually met "foreigner." The only Haitians who married whites were Haitians from the lower social stratas.
The same was true of marriage to someone who was from the middle east. People from there were also part of the lower social strata.
We called all of them (regardless of which part of the middle east they were from) "Syrien boite lan do." Regardless of how much money they had, they were not acceptable marriage partners for most upper class Haitian families.
That was when, in Haiti, upper class actually met something.
The status of who was upper class back then was not associated just with how much money you had; your family name in the archives of Haitian history was actually more important.
Skin color or money were secondary assets.
So you see, marrying white is a new disease.
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to Shadow on 20-Oct-07 02:56 PM
Interesting and in fact rightfully so - Haiti has experienced a dramatic change in it's socio-economic status quo over the years.
Time changes all things and I am speaking in terms of today's Haitian Diaspora.
American influences has contributed greatly in terms of the class (caste) system and the color of one's skin. Adhering to our African roots were indullably instilled in our blood back in those days, therefore Haitian life was different.
We as Haitian people have moved out of Haiti into various parts of the world and have bought back many influences with us - i.e food, ideaologies, fashion and etc. into Haiti.
Haiti will never be the same ever again.
Things are done differently now it's all about the survival of the fit's.
(Reply)
by Dan Xavier on 10/9
so what!
we as elite men have the same inclination towards pretty white women.
(Reply)
by clint, replying to Dan Xavier on 05-May-11 11:23 PM
daniel it's clint from little haiti in miami.
i'm still alive after the earthquake in hati. i was there!.
contact: clintocconor at yahoo.com
ecrim back neg pa. i'm in texas now.
(Reply)
by peter Marino, replying to Dan Xavier on 28-May-08 12:27 AM
check out the Haitian national soccer team this weekend in Fort Pierce at 7:30
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to Dan Xavier on 10-Oct-07 04:43 PM
I didn't say anything about looks.
Usually white men come already established financially.
You guys feel that the white color of a woman's skin gives you a certain status.
In fact you don't care how she looks or acts. What's up with that?
(Reply)
by dan Xavier, replying to lavie on 11-Oct-07 10:20 PM
well personally i would not be caught dead soliciting the affections of a trailer park star. but hey!
to each his own. in retrospect if we examine the socio-dynamics of the haitian family the male plays a dominant role in terms of finance in each socio-class that exist in haitian society from the habitant to the bourjois.
The main reason elite haitian women prefer white men maybe to secure their status and not lose it. by your own admonishing "white men come already established financially.
In essence us elite haitian men can do whatever we please, since the law of numbers are in our favor.
a little haitian history we haitian men have been seducing white women from the days of emperor napoleon sister to most recently princess Diana.
ofcourse you knew doddi fayed was a elite haitian/egyptian!
or do you not run in that circle
(Reply)
by dan Xavier, replying to lavie on 11-Oct-07 10:20 PM
well personally i would not be caught dead soliciting the affections of a trailer park star. but hey!
to each his own. in retrospect if we examine the socio-dynamics of the haitian family the male plays a dominant role in terms of finance in each socio-class that exist in haitian society from the habitant to the bourjois.
The main reason elite haitian women prefer white men maybe to secure their status and not lose it. by your own admonishing "white men come already established financially.
In essence us elite haitian men can do whatever we please, since the law of numbers are in our favor.
a little haitian history we haitian men have been seducing white women from the days of emperor napoleon sister to most recently princess Diana.
ofcourse you knew doddi fayed was a elite haitian/egyptian!
or do you not run in that circle
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to dan Xavier on 12-Oct-07 01:16 PM
You are full of yourself - and your facts are incorrect.
It is egocentric men like yourself who continually decrease the socio-dynamics of the Haitian bourjous family.
What you should be doing is maintaining the status quo by worshipping your black women and putting them high upon the pedestal where they belong.
We are the true Nubian Egytian Black Queens, hasn't history taught you anything.
It is Mohamed Al-Fayed not his son Dodi who had the privilege to be among the Haitian Elite.
I pardon you for not knowing any better, it's not your circle.
(Reply)
by dan Xavier, replying to lavie on 12-Oct-07 04:42 PM
Wow Your comments are interesting i've taken the time out to read quite a few of them. it did not take me that long to conduct a psycho-analysis of you lavie and come with a conclusion that i better leave you alone.
your bitter and until you deal with your personal issues that has, yes traumatized you.
you won't ever find true happiness.
so my nubian queen stay positive and may the Gran Met bless you!
its all about Haiti and what we need to do collectively(rich or poor) this generation to uplift our island nation to the prestige it once had!
luv ya!!
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to dan Xavier on 12-Oct-07 11:14 PM
That psycho-analysis is exactly the conclusion I wanted you to arrive at. Many Haitian women have had to leave their country and culture in order to achieve quality and equality in life. It's men like you who can help them maintain happiness in the Haitian diaspora.
I rarely speak about myself and my life on these forum's - I speak for the Diaries of all the mad Black women out there.
I myself am very fortunate to be happily married to a Haitian man who has had me firmly seated upon his pedestal for years.
My quest is for young Haitian girls to be aware of the hypocrisy perpetrated by men like you. Names tell me a lot about people, I know who and where the Hiaitian Elite are and you are questionable.
All I have to do is make a call if I'm not sure. I never told you or anyone for that matter that I prefered white men - The thought of it drives me mad. I just feel sympathy for those women who have had to cross that line - what a tradgety.
Can you see where I'm coming from just a tad bit....
now check yourself.
(Reply)
by mildred Arisitide, replying to lavie on 29-Sep-10 11:11 PM
Are you haitian?
if so this internet is a bunch of non sense their talking I believe their coming with a way to try, and manipulate us with this garbage we are haitians, and they should see thatthan to see skin color just like a you ask a jamaican from jamaica is he African he'll look at you stupid what a bunch of nonsense thats why haitians, jamaicans, and africans we can never get along with each other people try to stereotype us with this skin color shit thats why we go at it all the time I see now
(Reply)
by serge Desrameaux, replying to mildred Arisitide on 01-Oct-10 12:41 AM
You talk true, I like your response.Kase met nan men yo pou mwen, yo va reflechi pou yo pa di tout bagay.Men, li ka pa konprann sa w' vle di a.
Thanks.
(Reply)
by lavie Pierre, replying to mildred Arisitide on 30-Sep-10 01:03 PM
Hello my friend, thanks for responding to my article.
I expressed that several years back and they are still running it....
wow. I am not Haitian, I am of the West Indian Culture though.
My approach to this fact has somewhat changed in terms of explaining it. Actually there is no such thing as the White race or the Black race. We human beings biologically are "Homo Sapiens" with various cultural differences.
We all basically come in shades of brown to pink to white.
Haitian women seeking a man outside of their color range only means that they are attracted to the persons culture, experiences, education and etc. There is nothing wrong with that - God made us all different.
(Reply)
by xavier, replying to lavie on 14-Oct-07 09:15 PM
Listen sister, let's talk politics and about the future of haiti.
i will no longer entertain this subject, i've said all i needed to on the matter.
now if you want to discuss the security issues that we are facing as a nation or how we can work together to build haiti's tourism industry through strategic marketing let's share ideas so the next generation of haitian women will not have to leave their "country and culture" in order to achieve quality and equality in life
(Reply)
by lavie, replying to xavier on 16-Oct-07 05:10 AM
AMEN to that - I had a plan years ago for the tourism industry in Haiti.
It would help the poor people of Haiti in one way and the middle class in another.
I had envisioned mogul real estate developers such as trump to build huge mega resorts to improve the environment.
Poor people would work and live on the property.
They would receive a reasonable amount of money and a pention, free medical and free food. All of these things just to care for the property.
The middle class will enjoy the services just like they do when they go to other resorts.
In other words Haiti would be like a Disney Land, but more on the resort and relaxation level.
Do you get the concept - I'm sure there would be many loop holes to fill. Or maybe a congloberation of real estate developers who would merge together like a cooperative of sorts.
Also these developments would have their own police force.
My concept is that every living person in Haiti would be able to bank on it. I suppose Port au Prince would be like a ghost town at times.
Well, anyway that's my vision -What's yours?
(Reply)
< Previous 10 Comments Next Topic >
View all Topics | View All Messages < Previous Topic | Next Topic >
